I've seen discussions on #Fediverse about #Matrix and #IRC, but I think #XMPP got discarded offhand for some reason.

I'd like to know why so many people have gravitated towards Matrix, but not many towards XMPP. Also, why do Matrix detractors not advocate XMPP?

In particular, I'm concerned with the experience for non-technical users as well.

@sir, I'd appreciate your input, since I know you advocate IRC; is there anything specifically wrong with XMPP?

2/2

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@philipwhite the X is a big problem with XMPP

@sir As in XML? Or as in eXtensible? I assume XML. This seems to be the main issue I've seen regarding XMPP, but I don't understand it. What's wrong with XML?

The website has a writeup [1] that satisfied me when I read it. Do you disagree with their arguments?

[1] xmpp.org/about/myths.html

@philipwhite @sir problem is not XML. The problem with the extensibility is that the intersection of good usable client and servers is small. In other words it is easy for you to find a client that suits your needs on your Android phone. Then you need to find a server with the proper extensions (quite easy). Finally you want to discuss with your family, a third of them is using iOS and a second third wants a web client.

@philipwhite @sir finding clients for each platform supporting the same sets of XEP (that the name of XMPP extensions) is a real challenge which is slowing down the adoption of XMPP.

@philipwhite in my opinion it's both Xes ;) XML: not nice. Extensible: Depends.

There's a huge mess of extensions, and clients implement different ones. There is incompatibility. At the same time the protocol can be adapted to new trends and new features can quickly be integrated.

@sir

@JoergSorge @thomas @philipwhite @sir Seriously, I would like the idea of having a new-future-proof XMPP v2.0, that cleans up old that legacy stuff and adds the features you need. (less fractured)

The X is both a strength and a weakness, depending on your use case.
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