Many times, I've seen arguments made like this: "I'd try Mastodon, but I already have Twitter followers", or "I'd like to use OSM, but Google Maps has better data for my city", or, in my case, "I'd like to use sr.ht, but GitHub has better discoverability".
Platforms for which popularity improves the utility of the service are skewed in favor of the incumbents. New platforms face a chicken-and-egg problem. You have to decide - will you help it, or exacerbate it? Those are the only two choices you have.
Don't let that cool new platform die in obscurity while you wait for it to become popular.
@sir [conlang that actually works] is cool and all but all my friends are using English
@sir Network, a.k.a. bandwagon, effect.
@sir I really don't get the discoverability angle on GitHub! I tend to use DuckDuckGo, and couldn't care less where projects are hosted.
@alcinnz @sir P.P.S. To add more on the subject matter, while I used to praise GitLab, and even sorta maintained GitLab.com profile "for discoverability", after digging up the process of setting up the CI & CD (runners etc.), seeing them recommending things like
curl | bash etc. etc., I've became way colder towards them, even without the politics and (PL) religion.
@alcinnz @sir there is also the friction to having to sign up to individual self-hosted forges. I often find I don't go through the hassle, when I just want to leave a constructive comment, set a follow, or even place a star on the repo.
Maybe someone wants to pick that up again someday (though having CV on your own personal website also works fine).
See the AP watchlist 'Dead' category: https://git.feneas.org/feneas/fediverse/-/wikis/watchlist-for-activitypub-apps#its-dead-jim
@humanetech @amiloradovsky @alcinnz @sir this is the best solution, imo, and a natural fit for an already decentralized system: federate it! It shouldn't matter if a developer happened to start out in GH or GL or one of the other forges.
Of course, chances of the big players adopting (and opening up the garden walls) are slim to none, but one can hope. And todays de facto standard can be tomorrows wasteland - see freshmeat and sourceforge.
@doenietzomoeilijk @amiloradovsky @alcinnz @sir ah duh.. one link was at the top of the forum topics: https://talk.feneas.org/t/standard-list-of-existing-software-to-examine/194
There are issues, but those are meant for on-topic discussion and working together towards solving a problem.
As for search, couldn't you use generic web search engines for that purpose as well?
Generic search engines' first results aren't always about the software projects, also the cross links (mentioned this in there), etc.
Anyway, maybe the most important function the forges provide is CI & CD, even if the discussions may be held elsewhere.
@amiloradovsky @jordan31 @humanetech @alcinnz @sir
IMO CI can be easily an external service. You can even have multiple CIs for the same project and it doesn't cause much of a problem, because CI tends to be stateless.
IMO what matters is a source repository, a bug tracker, and something for patch submission/review.
@humanetech @wolf480pl @jordan31 @alcinnz @sir Yes, modularity and interoperability of different providers of the modules is desirable.
There just has to be an interface to pick up the build statuses from the farm, and draw appropriate signs next to the place where the changes/patches are submitted for review.
@wolf480pl @jordan31 @humanetech @alcinnz @sir It all is easy to provide in separation, what is special about forges is the integration: the results of CI are shown next to the MRs/PRs, and the commits mentioning the issue are shown under the issue, and so on and so forth.
I don't know how to characterize it concisely.
Speaking why GH is so dominant, it's definitely not any particular feature(s), but simply the inertia. Unwillingness to take any further actions. Most of the developers of projects hosted on there simply don't give a damn about the "ecology".
One can easily push to multiple repositories at once or mirror them, what won't be synchronized is the issues, wiki, CI badges may need some extra efforts too.
@jordan31 @wolf480pl @humanetech @alcinnz @sir SourceHut/sr.ht is pretty good, much cleaner as outside as inside than GitLab. It only needs more projects using it, to gain the critical mass.
If you still miss something from GitLab though, and can't/don't want to self-host, better use FramaGit than GitLab.com.
> If you still miss something from GitLab though, and can't/don't want to self-host, better use FramaGit than GitLab.com.
Depending on the nature of your project, there are many, many options other than GH, GL.com, or self-hosting. Some examples:
@jordan31 It's similar for me, except I have a CGit web interface so you can navigate the code online.
Are you doing anything for issue tracking? I'm placing markdown files in an ISSUES directory, and am finding that's working better for me. It certainly integrates into git better!
Although the particular issues and change-sets may be addressed not by just their number, but also qualified with the host/user.
GitLab does this already (turning the mentions into the links), but there is no reverse linking / "mentioning of mentioning" across servers.
Another issue with cross-commenting is possibility of spam (remember how vulnerable Fediverse is for it?).
> there is also the friction to having to sign up to inividual self-hosted forges
This is one of the advantages of #SourceHut over most of the other forge platforms (Savannah, GH, GL, #GitTea, etc), you can interact with some aspects of a repo just by sending email, without needing an account on the server. After all, an account on a website just means that you're (probably) a human with a working email address.
@amiloradovsky I've used Gitlab's CI quite a bit (we self hosted GitLab at my last company). I've never had to run/maintain Gitlab CI, but I remember at that particular shop, the upgrade process was painful and required some downtime. I've heard maintaining a company or self-hosted install isn't that great. I don't have experience admining it personally though. Currently I'm a Jenkins admin at my shop, but our code is still on GitHub (paid/teams, but not enterprise). @alcinnz @sir
I just prefer to have an instructions for humans, and not only a magic script to run.
Plus, the script's OS detection and URL composition algorithms are not straight-forward. Why can't I have just an explanation what to download and where?
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