Humans are not fundamentally evil, or fundamentally good. Humans are *easily manipulated*. And we set up a system where evil is rewarded and good is punished, and those who reap the rewards of that system are well positioned to manipulate humanity into serving their warped desires.

@sir “We” didn’t set up the system, so much as wecouldn’t stop the evil humans from doing it. “We” being our ancestors, back quite a few generations.

But you’re totally right.

@cy @sir I'm not completely convinced that we are much different from our ancestors of the past at least ten thousand years. But each generation tends to blame the previous one that never gets old.

@DesCoutinho @cy often the previous one tends to be at fault. The problem is that ultimately the current generation will become the previous generation

@sir @cy Humans are easily manipulated precisely because they’re evil. It doesn’t take much to “manipulate” someone into doing stuff he’d do anyway. As a corollary, no amount of gentle nudging will make people benevolent. Charity, justice and personal responsibility have stood as the corner stones of our self-critical society for a long time now. Yet inevitably I’ve discovered people, especially mothers, refuse to hear of the concept if they can’t be the arbiters of it, or if it comes from people they think less of. On the other hand, proposals such as “get the Earth rid of extra people” were usually met with skepticism at them being possible to accomplish, rather than outrage.

@login2me @sir Y’know, once I got a phone call saying they were the Social Security Administration and my SSN had been compromised, and they wanted to verify that this was the correct phone number. I didn’t fall for it, but people who do are evil?

@login2me @sir As for “personal responsibility” I highly recommend this film series:

Don’t worry the guy leans further left than Chomsky.

I’d put up a torrent, but I don’t know any open trackers outside of i2p.

@cy @sir When it comes to punishing men, Philosophy Tube goes all hands for personal responsibility.

So much for political consistency.

@login2me @sir Uh… huh. I kind of drifted off when they said “he can’t just say men and women?” But I did watch the actual video, and he is not convinced men should be punished, and feels it’d be entirely unjustified if kids weren’t punished by the system, for having single mothers. So maybe… a pinkie finger for personal responsibility? I do agree he’s completely ignoring the lack of agency caused by sexual arousal. His stuff on liberalism is spot on, though.

@cy @sir > "feels it’d be entirely unjustified if kids weren’t punished by the system, for having single mothers"

Citation please. That guy PT *promotes* single motherhood, otherwise he'd be "equal shared parenting or bust."

"ignoring the lack of agency caused by sexual arousal"

This shit is insane and I don't allow you to drag me down that path.

@login2me @sir Uh… yeah… I think there’s a fundamental disconnect somewhere here. Perhaps we should talk about something else.

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